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Double Rear Vents?


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#1 ModTailor

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Posted 11 September 2019 - 12:58 PM

Hello, I'm new to the forum, but not to tailoring. I'm a home tailor making things only for myself and have made a pair of trousers as well as shirts and a jacket. I'm about to start a new project based on a mod suit from the '60s, however, I can't wrap my head around how to sew or draft the back. It seems as though it has a set of vents and next to them pleats. Here is a photo-suit_zpsforkckio.jpeg

Has anyone every seen something like this or have experience doing it? Any help greatly appreciated! The vent is on the left and the pleat is close to the center. It looks to me like the vent/pleat section is extra that is sewn on to a regular back that has been cut out for them.


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#2 tombennett

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Posted 11 September 2019 - 08:46 PM

Having been a mod (1980s) there was great experimentation with cuts in the early 60s, most of the styles were based upon Ivy League and Italian cuts. Have you got any better photos of this.

 

Can you post the image using a different service as it looks like photo bucket are messing about again and blurring the images.

 

Many thanks, Tom,


Edited by tombennett, 11 September 2019 - 08:55 PM.

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#3 ModTailor

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Posted 12 September 2019 - 10:23 AM

Hi Tom, I'll try to get some better photos in a moment, but the screen capture on my laptop is not working so I have to use my phone which may contribute to the poor quality. Here is the photo again on a different service.

48719508506_fe6ca9bcd1_b.jpgsuit



#4 ModTailor

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Posted 12 September 2019 - 01:19 PM

Alright here are some more photos. These are all screen captures from the film A Hard Days Night by the way. George and John both had suit with this odd back on it.

48719700428_76d4b6896b_b.jpg

48720038131_89b316de35_b.jpg

48720206372_1f7d19f729.jpg

48720208217_b7bef90c38_b.jpg

48719698538_7a1844c3de_z.jpg

48719698448_2b3905bff8_z.jpg

48720206022_1d4e7d8193_z.jpg

I think the first photo shows best what I mean by a pleat and a vent. I also think I have it figured out though as well. I'll be making a muslin of it hopefully this weekend. I plan on a grey gabardine wool mix for the suit and side tabs on the trousers.



#5 tombennett

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Posted 13 September 2019 - 01:57 AM

This is the jacket you're looking at, not sure why they had all those seems and pleats. I probably would approach it by cutting the back pattern then cutting across at the required level. Make two vertical cuts in the lower section, on e for the "seam" adjacent to the CB, the second for the pleat. Open the pleat for the desired depth and join with piece of paper to fill the pattern out, the slit at the side is done in the usual way. The positioning of the horizontal seam is on a fashion waist length not the natural or hip lines. When the pattern is complete I would fold the pleat and trim the top and bottom so the pattern works when opened, not sure I have explained that last bit clearly.

 

Interesting idea, not sure it has any practical reason as pleats higher up would do and could imagine Ringo using something like an action-back coat when "drumming". As with most of the stuff from that era it is very boxy, they tended to take their styling from the African-American R&B groups of the late 50 early 60s.
 

0e4217c591029209e4c909a2327529e6.jpg



#6 tombennett

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Posted 13 September 2019 - 04:05 AM

Here's a half scale of what I imagine the pattern would look like. I've put the seam to low should be nearer the waist but it is only an example that took 2 secs. I also think I would curve the top seam a little to so it works better with the body. The image I have posted is a modern reconstruction and made for costume hire/stage performances so probably not a lot of thought went into the cut. I'm sure you can make something that looks a lot more stylish.

 

MG-5099.jpg


Edited by tombennett, 13 September 2019 - 04:24 AM.


#7 tombennett

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Posted 13 September 2019 - 05:04 AM

Here's another image of it from the film, it is as the reproduction. You know, looking at the back more and the seam placements there is a reminiscence the old military dress coats from the late 19th to early 20th century which had similar arrangements on the flaps, where I can see practice reasons for the pleats.

 

lenon-coat.png



#8 tombennett

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Posted 13 September 2019 - 05:16 AM

If you look at the following image from my copy of Thornton you can see where the idea has come from. It is to give a nod to 6 seamers with a seam across a fashion waist, the extra seams to suggest the panels of a mess coat.

 

MG-5100.jpg



#9 tombennett

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Posted 13 September 2019 - 05:25 AM

For anyone interested in the Beetles wearing this garment here is the link to the video https://www.youtube....h?v=FV_PGs0m34U



#10 ModTailor

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Posted 13 September 2019 - 07:45 AM

Those are the stage suits, if you notice, the pleats face the other way on the style I'm trying to make, but I think your draft would work and then I can just flip the pleat the other way around. Those reproductions suits were made off of Johns original, and actually the whole bands pattern set for those suits is for sale currently. I'm trying to make one based off of George's suit in the beginning of the film with the black velvet collar and narrow lapels. Thanks a lot for all the help!


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#11 tombennett

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Posted 13 September 2019 - 05:18 PM

No worries. It was a long day. Just fold the pleat the other way and over a little, the pattern will be roughly the same. The position of the seams and pleat are just illustrative, I would put the horizontal seam a little higher as well. sixties beatwear you mean? Seen their stuff, great for stage costume, though with all that polyester it'll be a warm affair I imagine. Do you know who the original designer is? I once made one with a velvet Prussian style collar and placket covering the buttons..Look forward to seeing your version.



#12 ModTailor

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Posted 13 September 2019 - 09:49 PM

The suit you posted was made by R.W. Lease. He bought Paul's Shea Stadium coat and several other items to copy. They're made exactly as the originals so that could be good or bad for comfort and usability. The original maker for all of their suits was Douglas Millings.



#13 tombennett

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Posted 14 September 2019 - 12:23 AM

For what they were for they look okay. Douglas Millings, of course, my memory is a bit shot.



#14 ModTailor

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Posted 18 September 2019 - 12:39 PM

Quite a bit of spam in here, eh? Anyway here is my attempt so far. I'm using a polyester suiting from the local fabric store which will actually be wearable and is the same color of what I"m going to make so it's a pretty good representation. I think it turned out pretty well.

48752502737_e2a3300b11_k.jpgSuit

 

48752313526_de4f5ed53b_k.jpgSuit

 



#15 tombennett

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Posted 18 September 2019 - 06:36 PM

The pleats look in a similar place. IMO the tops of the side seams, above your notches, are a bit to curved to be able to work in any significant drape for movement. If you notice, on the stage versions, there is a fair bit of drape at the back of scye, which, if you don't mind me saying, look a bit straight. What system do you use?

I wonder how the moderators feel that there is a coat topic on the Basic Board, if there is an issue we can take topic to the other place where anything goes.


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#16 Schneiderfrei

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Posted 18 September 2019 - 07:28 PM

My impression was that coat making was excluded from the Basic Appr section because of trouble amongst the contributors.  If we keep things polite and reasonable, maybe no one will notice. :)


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Shell made out of gold
Found on a beach picked up and you held so close


#17 ModTailor

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Posted 19 September 2019 - 07:53 AM

To be perfectly honest I didn't draft the pattern for this coat. I intended to, but realized I had a jacket that I didn't like the material of that I previously made off of a commercial pattern and had modified to fit me well and to a mod style already so I pulled it apart and modified it to make this coat.


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