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Shirt Draft Review - Help Needed


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#37 posaune

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Posted 27 July 2017 - 06:43 PM

Yes, Bustpoint definition is okay.
No, the armscye circ is untouched - it just swing a bit to the top.
You have just added length to the side seam. This surplus length you snip away at hem.
lg
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#38 posaune

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Posted 28 July 2017 - 04:57 AM

here is an example
http://www.threadsma...stment/page/all
lg
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#39 Elsastreprincipiante

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Posted 06 August 2017 - 10:05 AM

It has been a week or so but I finally had a chance to make some corrections to the horizontal slash on the right side. The right armscye circumference is now the same diameter as original. I closed up the horizontal slash from 2.5cm down to just 1.2cm. The cloth was very accepting of this and I hope it will go smoothly on the pattern as well. Peterle, I also closed  up that 0.5cm that you pointed out. I think the right front is starting to look fairly reasonable. I think that next I should translate all of this to my patterns and cut another shirt but I'm not sure. Are there any other fitment issues I  should try to resolve before I cut another shirt or should start by applying the bust changes to the left side and then true up the shoulders on the pattern and cut another draft? I know that I'll also need to take care of the left armscye depth to correct for the shoulder. I'm wondering, what are your thoughts on how much I adjusted the left shoulder? Is it too much? Too little? I can still see slight diagonal drag lines in the back but I'm not sure if I  should remove additional fabric from the left shoulder. I also see drag lines from the shoulder blades but I don't know when I should correct these. I also see a small vertical drag line on the front right armscye. I guess I'm not sure what to focus on next.

 

To summarize the fitment issues I can see and the adjustments I need:

  1. Scoop out left armscye to compensate for left shoulder.
  2. Apply bust expansion to left side.
  3. True up shoulders from bust expansion.
  4. Vertical drag line on right-front armscye - what to do about this?
  5. Shoulder blade drag lines - what to do about these?
  6. Vertical drag line near right shoulder blade - what causes this?

front-patched.jpg

 

back-patched.jpg

 

right-patched.jpg

 

right-angle-patched.jpg

 

shirt-patch.jpg


Edited by Elsastreprincipiante, 06 August 2017 - 10:06 AM.


#40 peterle

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Posted 06 August 2017 - 08:36 PM

When you install another 2,5cm at the left front , the front will be quite wide I think. (plus 5cm is quite much). It seems to me that the front is wide enough with the added 2,5cm. Maybe widening each front part for only 1,5cm (makes 3cm total) from the original will be enough.

 

The left armhole base line should be lowered for the same amount as the shoulder. Maybe the diagonal folds will disappear then (maybe not).

 

I think(but hard to tell from the pics only) you overdid the darts in the back yoke seam a bit. It seems to me, that the shirt is quite tight at the armholes but a bit loose at the center in the yokes seam area. Reducing theses darts widths will also effect the back folds because the back will gain some length over the shoulderblades.

 

And I think your waistline is to low. Your natural waist is higher than the shirts waist. so shift your waist nipping and back darts upwards  for about 5cm. (rule of thumb: CB neck to waistline is 1/4 body hight)


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#41 Elsastreprincipiante

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Posted 06 August 2017 - 11:46 PM

Peterle, thank you very much for the detailed feedback. I will go ahead and lower the left armscye on this draft and see what things look like. It also makes sense what you are saying about the front width so I'll split that width across both front halves in the next draft. That should help even more with keeping that horizontal bust slash tiny.

On to the yoke darts. The measurements for those darts came from separating the yoke front the back portion of the shirt and measuring the separation at the center. I can't remember how much it spread but it think it was 2.5cm. So I added 2.5cm at the center back and tapered down to no additional fabric at the armscyes. So if I understand correctly, you are suggesting that I adjust my horizontal darts to be less wide? I mean to say that the darts will still taper from 2.5cm down to 0 but they'll start to taper closer to the armscye?

Speaking of my waist, what cues help you identify that my shirt waist does not align with my natural waist? Are there fitment issues being caused by this that you can see or can you just tell from years of experience that the waist looks too low?

On an odd note, does anyone have any photos of what a correct-fitting shirt should look like while tucked in? It's as always, quite hard to find many fitment photos. I have quite a hollow lower back so it seems I can never remove enough to create a shirt that isn't blossoming at the rear.
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#42 peterle

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Posted 07 August 2017 - 04:54 AM

 On to the yoke darts. The measurements for those darts came from separating the yoke front the back portion of the shirt and measuring the separation at the center. I can't remember how much it spread but it think it was 2.5cm. So I added 2.5cm at the center back and tapered down to no additional fabric at the armscyes. So if I understand correctly, you are suggesting that I adjust my horizontal darts to be less wide? I mean to say that the darts will still taper from 2.5cm down to 0 but they'll start to taper closer to the armscye?

 

No. I think the darts should be less than 2,5cm wide at the scye. let´s say 2cm or 1,8cm.(just guessing)

 

Speaking of my waist, what cues help you identify that my shirt waist does not align with my natural waist? Are there fitment issues being caused by this that you can see or can you just tell from years of experience that the waist looks too low?

 

Well, I can see where the fabric breaks at the side seam and shows your waist. And I can see that the widest part of your darts is lower than that. And I can see that the proportions are a bit off. The natural waist is usually at the elbows. When you do waist nipping and back darts you have to determin the horizontal waistline first.(rule of thumb see above). The widest cut out of the darts and the widest cut out in the side seam should be at the waistline.

 

When you want to dip deeper in proportions, look up the 8 head kanon. You will learn that the waistline divides the human body in the golden ratio (3:5): five heads from ground to the waist and three heads from the waist to the crown.(wich makes waist to CB neck two heads or 1/4 body hight).


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#43 Elsastreprincipiante

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Posted 14 August 2017 - 01:34 AM

I am currently in the process of incorporating all the modifications into a new set of patterns. One of the modifications I'm having issues with is adjusting for my left shoulder slope. After some valuable feedback and direction from all of you, I determined 2.5cm needed to be removed from the left shoulder. The problem I'm facing though is I'm not sure how to correctly remove that from the pattern and adjust the armscye accordingly. By removing so much, I changed the angle at which the front and yoke meet and I'm not sure how to redraft that area. I tried searching for answers but in the articles I found, everyone just ignored that the yoke and front met at a not-smooth angle. Any help or direction would be greatly appreciated!

 

left-shoulder-adjustment.jpg



#44 greger

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Posted 14 August 2017 - 06:06 AM

Sometimes holes can be punched in the pattern for the lower shoulder and armhole (it may include the neck line). When chalking the pattern on the cloth rub a bit of chalk dust into those holes for the lower side, so you know where to cut that side. 



#45 peterle

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Posted 14 August 2017 - 07:36 PM

1. Did you move the whole armhole line downwards? (shift it parallel downwards for the estimated amount).

 

2. You have to smooth the new lines/crosspoints to have a pleasent line. When you wear the altered shirt (you didn´t add a left sides view) you can see there is an unpleasent gap at the yoke seam. This is to be smoothed.Most probably you will keep the armhole line of the yoke as is and continue a smooth line into the front. This will hollow the front armhole line at the top. best is to sketch the line onto the toile when wearing.


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#46 Elsastreprincipiante

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Posted 15 August 2017 - 10:30 AM

Peterle, in my previous post I had not yet lowered the armscye the equivalent amount. I taped the trimmed shoulder pieces back on and went about lowering the armscye. I've detailed my steps below. Can someone confirm that I went about this in the correct way? The thing I'm still having issues with understand is the yoke-to-front shoulder point. It's a very sharp angle and I don’t see how I could possibly create a smooth line from that angle without serious scooping out the front of the armscye. I also have no idea how this affects the fit of the neck since the angle has been opened up considerably. I've drawn on a few lines for reference. If anyone has an example of how this should be done, I'd desperately appreciate it! I've spent so much time searching online but nobody seems to have such a sharp angle as me and I can't find any good tutorials on the topic.

 

step-1.jpg

 

step-2.jpg

 

step-3.jpg

 

step-4.jpg

 

step-5.jpg


Edited by Elsastreprincipiante, 15 August 2017 - 10:31 AM.


#47 peterle

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Posted 15 August 2017 - 06:23 PM

You just did this alterations in the toile. You can see the neck fits in the toile, so be confident in your toile.

As I wrote, you will have to hollow ( =scoop out) the front scye.

In your last pic ist seems the  front seam of the yoke got a bit shorter. So fill this gap and scoop out the armhole line a bit. Take your burmester curve, wider side upwards, place the wider side at the yoke armhole seam and draw a nice curve through the shoulderpiont of the front.

 

BTW: it seems to me your lower armhole curve is a bit full? Is it tight when wearing?



#48 posaune

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Posted 15 August 2017 - 11:43 PM

I will just add something
http://www.mediafire...u5/schulter.png
here you find how it looks when you have a 21 cm shirt shoulderlength and set the armhole 2 cm deeper.
You do 2.5 and your shoulder is how long? 16-18 cm? That will mean you get a nasty angle.

When you have such a deep hanging shoulder this would effect the whole body not only left side
- you must go to the right side to the neckpoint or if necessary to shoulderpoint with your alteration.
In some cases you do not take the measurements as they are. You must balance them out to get a nice look.
I would take 1.5 cm for deeping the left armhole and look how it went.
lg
posaune

Edited by posaune, 15 August 2017 - 11:57 PM.





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