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Dinner Suit


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#1 NuMor

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Posted 27 November 2011 - 03:24 AM

Dear Cutter and Tailor Members,

I need to have a dinner suit made, would you please help me with ideas for possible styles - SB, DB, type of trousers to be worn (if any in particular; belt, no belt, suspenders, etc.) - and post pictures to help me visualise the whole thing. Thank you.

Forgot to mention, what would be the best type of fabric for this? Barathea? Something else? Thanks again.

Edited by NuMor, 27 November 2011 - 04:13 AM.


#2 dkst

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Posted 27 November 2011 - 05:22 AM

I thought these examples from Voxsartoria's blog were very flattering.

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#3 carpu65

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Posted 27 November 2011 - 02:18 PM

Strange.
The six buttons model seems be the more fashonable dinner jacket in these days.
This is a change,because DB dinner jaker were for the most four buttons.
Well im old fashioned and i like a model that now is considered "uncool":
shawl collar, single or double breasted.

#4 NuMor

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Posted 27 November 2011 - 03:51 PM

Thanks dkst! This helps.

#5 NuMor

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Posted 27 November 2011 - 03:53 PM

(...) a model that now is considered "uncool":
shawl collar, single or double breasted.


This model seems interesting, would you happen to have pictures, of both SB and DB with shawl collar? Thanks.

#6 rs232

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Posted 27 November 2011 - 05:59 PM

Agree on the shawl collar. My personal opinion is that it just looks sleeker.

Here are some SB and DBs:

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Sator's take on the issue here.

#7 Sator

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Posted 27 November 2011 - 08:02 PM

My take on it today: order whatever you like! If it looks good do it, just make sure it fits perfectly with cloth and construction as fine as you can afford. Don't seek approval on-line, the only people who matter are the real people around you. Listen most of all to the advice of your tailor.

Barathea is a traditional weave along with venetians, and faille but any reason for choosing these specifically for evening dress is probably entirely historical and of little relevance today. In fact, I have come across texts talking about the use of Fresco type weaves for summer wear. Modern worsteds are very fine and smooth making them all highly suitable for evening dress. Again listen to your tailor.

#8 Schneidergott

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Posted 27 November 2011 - 08:22 PM

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"Nur der ist Meister seiner Kunst, der immer sucht, das Gute zu verbessern und niemals glaubt, das Beste schon zu haben."
"Only he is a master of his art who always seeks to improve the good and never believes to have the best already"

http://www.dressedwell.net/ It's snarky, but fun.


#9 Sir Rodney Ffing

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Posted 27 November 2011 - 11:12 PM

Dear Cutter and Tailor Members,

I need to have a dinner suit made, would you please help me with ideas for possible styles - SB, DB, type of trousers to be worn (if any in particular; belt, no belt, suspenders, etc.) - and post pictures to help me visualise the whole thing. Thank you.

Forgot to mention, what would be the best type of fabric for this? Barathea? Something else? Thanks again.


Others have covered styling options. Material wise:

Barathea.
Mohair.
Faille.
Tussah.
Silk.
Velvet.
Cashmere cordurouy in a fine wale.

Are all possibilities.

If you take a look over at Davide Taub's website he's made one out of linen, unlined. The linen seems to have a special finish applied to it. A nice suggestion for summer black tie.

The first 4 in the list would lend themselves to a nice, crisp formal look (especially mohair) quite traditional.

The last two, and the linen option lend themselves to a more louche even playboy look to my mind. A touch rich, a touch decadent.

I like both looks, but you have to pick the look that suits your personalty. You need to be comfortable, to look relaxed which is what you want at a black tie event.

Good luck.

#10 carpu65

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Posted 28 November 2011 - 10:42 AM

Tussah still exist?

#11 Sator

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Posted 28 November 2011 - 03:01 PM

Many of these eg barathea, faille are what are known as silk weaves. I suspect that the reason for this was to give the cloth more lustre and smoothness. These days, super wools have enough fineness and lustre to make them suitable for evening and formal dress. I have seen some Dormeuil Jade - S160s wool blended with jade - go through the shop and which have made up quite beautifully. Since evening clothes are for occasional wear this sort of luxury cloth is ideal. If you can afford it.

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#12 Sator

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Posted 28 November 2011 - 03:25 PM

you have to pick the look that suits your personality. You need to be comfortable, to look relaxed which is what you want at a black tie event.


Absolutely. If you've got the personality then there's no reason you can't wear something like this:

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And, yes, these too are bespoke garments. If the fit, the cloth quality and construction are all absolutely top notch it will look absolutely spectacular.

However, you would need an outsized personality to go with it! Otherwise, going for something more conservative (the euphemism is "classical") and which doesn't stand out as much might be better. You are less likely to be under pressure to surprise everyone with something new next time, and won't be greeted with "you're not wearing that outfit again are you?" when you wear it to other events. That is, in addition to an outsized personality you need an outsized wallet - plus a collection of fast cars, fast women etc.

#13 Sir Rodney Ffing

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Posted 29 November 2011 - 03:51 AM

Many of these eg barathea, faille are what are known as silk weaves. I suspect that the reason for this was to give the cloth more lustre and smoothness. These days, super wools have enough fineness and lustre to make them suitable for evening and formal dress. I have seen some Dormeuil Jade - S160s wool blended with jade - go through the shop and which have made up quite beautifully. Since evening clothes are for occasional wear this sort of luxury cloth is ideal. If you can afford it.

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Yes, Faile, Barathea and Tussah were originally silk weaves but have been created in all wool cloths which have had some special finishing technique applied to them that gives the cloth that depth and sparkle that silk suiting has.

Saying that, I have seen merino wool and tussah silk mixes back in the late 80's early 90's. Back then, you used to get some pretty exotic mixes like wool and chinchilla for example.

Another option are cloths with fancy 'jacquard' type weaves. Scabal has a formal book full of these and IIRC they tend to be in silk.

#14 carpu65

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Posted 29 November 2011 - 05:48 AM

Who make tussah (pure tussah,without wool) today?

#15 Sator

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Posted 29 November 2011 - 10:31 AM

I don't know what the others here think but I have been taught to avoid wool-silk blends. The reason is that the two fibres shrink differently and if this occurs you can get bubbling.

My texts say that tussah is a coarse, light brown silk produced by undomesticated silkworms, especially the tussah silkworm. The filaments are duller and stiffer than regular silk. It takes poorly to dye and is often left in a natural colour. It doesn't sound like the sort of thing that is particularly fashionable these days, being rather stiff and coarse.

As for the fancy designs in the Scabal formal book, I agree there are some interesting things in there. Again, it's all about personality: if you want a conservative ("classic") look then it's not going to be for you. Of course, there is the option of having a very conservative coat and trousers made up and then going for a fancy (a euphemism for loud) waistcoat. Or else you could have two waistcoats made up - one in matching cloth, and one of fancy cloth.

#16 carpu65

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Posted 29 November 2011 - 12:33 PM

The cloth of the Rubinacci's 30s holy grail,the iconic double breasted is tussah.
Is natural color,of course.

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Is strong stuff,brother. :ermm:
I know some permanent style guys and divers 30s fetishists could kill for a few of tussah. :unsure:

#17 ladhrann

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Posted 02 December 2011 - 09:35 PM

So is silk tussah still made anywhere? I can't find silk velvet either. I'm looking for some for a smoking jacket.

#18 Kerry

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Posted 02 December 2011 - 11:20 PM

So is silk tussah still made anywhere? I can't find silk velvet either. I'm looking for some for a smoking jacket.


RJW stock silk velvet.

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