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Tight trouser seat: extend fork or add to seat?


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#1 deborahlewislondon

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Posted 21 October 2016 - 08:27 PM

Hi there, 

 

Can you help me understand the difference between these two possible alterations? 

 

When trousers are tight in the lower seat area should I extend the forkline or add to the seat curve? (Edited:  Add Seat alteration does not shorten back seam) 

 

What is the main difference between these two alterations in terms of their effect on a tight lower seat? 

 

What questions would I ask my customer to gauge what the problem is exactly? 

 

Any advice/info would be great. Thank you! 

 

Deborah 

 

(Edited: Clearer diagrams added)

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Edited by deborahlewislondon, 22 October 2016 - 06:08 PM.


#2 posaune

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Posted 21 October 2016 - 11:05 PM

If you do b) you will have more length over the seat. The angle will not be altered. The room inside will be bigger.
Back thigh has more fabric.

If you do a)there will be a shorter back seam, the angle will be altered. You add fabric at the back crotch
but the room inside will be smaller. back thight will stay as is.
lg
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#3 deborahlewislondon

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Posted 21 October 2016 - 11:21 PM

Thank you Pousaune. That makes sense. But I'm still confused about the following: 

 

Under what circumstances can 'room inside will be smaller' be an effective alteration for a tight fitting seat? 


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#4 Der Zuschneider

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Posted 22 October 2016 - 12:38 AM

Picture a: Hollowing out the seat is like picture b, if the trouser has enough ease over the hip.

 

The less hollowing in picture a, the more the seams pulls into the crack, which is good for jeans, so they don't get a hang like a diaper.

 

Picture a is good just calculate the right Spaltdurchmesser, which ist not so easy to do.


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#5 deborahlewislondon

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Posted 22 October 2016 - 02:42 AM

Thank you Der Zuschneider. 

 

I've edited the diagrams to show the direction of the alteration that I'm referring to. I think we are going in opposite directions?! 

 

* Also, hard to see, but the 'Add Seat' alteration does not shorten the back seam - what comes out goes back in at the waistline (slightly raised angle). 


Edited by deborahlewislondon, 22 October 2016 - 02:46 AM.


#6 Schneidergott

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Posted 22 October 2016 - 04:39 AM

Have a look at how the creases behave.

If they look twisted or pulled towards the inner or outer leg it's most likely a fork issue (sometimes combined with strong thighs).

If the tightness is across the seat (tension on the CB seat seam and most likely gaping pockets) it's a width issue and you need to add ease. Adding fork width (1/2 of what you add to the seat width) will help, too.

BTW, that also works the other way round, when you reduce the seat width. When the seat is tight try the next bigger size trouser. It's often easier and simpler to reduce the waist.

 

When you measure a person's seat width keep the tape loose enough to be able to move it. Check your charts to see what the ease in the size you try on should be. You need at least 2" for close fitting trousers to keep them comfortable.

FYI, for unpleated and/ or close fitting trouser it makes sense to add/ have a pinch dart in the fronts, as it adds width for the hip bone and avoids gaping pockets.


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#7 deborahlewislondon

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Posted 22 October 2016 - 06:44 AM

Thank you Schneidergott! 

 

This is really helpful. Do you (or anyone) know of a site/ link to 'tight seat' diagrams/photos I could look at examples of the difference between these two behaviours? 



#8 greger

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Posted 22 October 2016 - 04:30 PM

The drafts don't look right to me.
The outseam has to much curve in it. Straighter with slight curve would be better.
The seat seam line is gouged, and then getting wider at the waist, instead of straight, or tapering to a smaller waist.
A wider waist would be added to the the top of the outseam, not seat seam.
Some tailors add 1/2 to 1 inch along the outseam in case they need to widen.
Some tailors add 1/2 inch inlay to both outseam and inseam just to add weight, because they think the pant legs hang better (this is the back only, not the front).

#9 deborahlewislondon

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Posted 22 October 2016 - 06:00 PM

Thanks Greger.

 

That's interesting especially about that 'a wider waist would be added to the top of the outseam, not seat seam.' And about the added weight.

 

You're right the seat seam line is incorrect - I have edited the diagram to show the actual change - the one I posted before showed the difference between 'subtract seat to add seat' - I did that because it was easier to spot the difference, but I should have known better! The curve outseam is as it is.



#10 greger

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Posted 23 October 2016 - 03:51 PM

Is this existing trousers? Or, a pattern you are working with? Some tailors figure out the pattern right on the cloth. On the cloth you can draw a better curve. Some tailors paste or tape paper to the pattern and draw the correct lines onto the paper. You don't want to be owned by any pattern.

#11 deborahlewislondon

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Posted 24 October 2016 - 05:05 AM

Hi Greger, I'm working with a toile and altering the exact pattern it came with. The toile fits perfectly except for the tight lower seat. I've taken everything said here into consideration and have extended the fork. I'll let you know how it works out. Thanks all.  :yes:






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