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A Golden Age of Italian Tailoring: Galliano Caraceni


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#37 carpu65

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Posted 25 May 2010 - 01:19 PM

Galliano Caraceni for the Italian actor Gabriele Ferzetti (1959);
A wonderful dinner jacket blue midnight,double breasted with shawl collar.

Posted Image

Compare with the garish shawl collar of Sciàmat.

Posted Image

Edited by carpu65, 25 May 2010 - 01:22 PM.


#38 Sator

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Posted 27 May 2010 - 11:06 PM

By the way: jefferyD is dissecting a 1998 Caraceni from Milano.
I'm curious what the inside does look like. The outside already shows extraordinary finishing skills!


Here is the inside :Shocked:

Posted Image

However, it is an A. Caraceni from 1998, rather than a Domenico Caraceni.

It's also reminder of the fact that Strobel machines are classically advertised as being for both the chest as well as the lapels. You also see discussion in vintage Rundschau editions about using the Strobel in the chest.

#39 Schneidergott

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Posted 28 May 2010 - 01:17 AM

Here is the inside :Shocked:

Posted Image

However, it is an A. Caraceni from 1998, rather than a Domenico Caraceni.

It's also reminder of the fact that Strobel machines are classically advertised as being for both the chest as well as the lapels. You also see discussion in vintage Rundschau editions about using the Strobel in the chest.



I have such a Strobel pad stitch machine

Posted Image

and if used well it gives an effect very similar to hand stitches. The thing is that in this case it seems to have been done by a regular blind stitch machine.
If you look at the machine in the picture you'll notice this sort of narrow metal horn.

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This allows to roll the lapel (almost) like you'd do with your hands.
The other machine is flat and does not allow for this special treatment. Hard to tell which one has been used here. Since the different layers of the canvas have been distorted somewhat I lend towards the "regular" blind stitch machine. This is also supported by the rather flat appearance of the lapels.

I am also surprised to see some sloppy execution of the chest welt pocket bag. I usually cut it in the angle of the welt, so it would share a grain line with the cloth.

A while back I found a little video (but I forgot where) with M. Caraceni (wearing one of his suits, of course) explaining the tasks of a bespoke tailor (in Italian, though). Pity I did not download it.

Edited by Schneidergott, 28 May 2010 - 02:21 AM.

"Nur der ist Meister seiner Kunst, der immer sucht, das Gute zu verbessern und niemals glaubt, das Beste schon zu haben."
"Only he is a master of his art who always seeks to improve the good and never believes to have the best already"

http://www.dressedwell.net/ It's snarky, but fun.


#40 Sator

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Posted 28 May 2010 - 02:02 AM

Yes, I've got an excellent ad from a 1950s Rundschau that goes into great lengths to explain these features and how the machine works.

#41 Schneidergott

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Posted 28 May 2010 - 05:29 AM

I at least found one video with Mario Caraceni (wearing one of his famous DB):

http://www.maniwealt...otary/Nord.html

Purtroppo in italiano solo!

Funny story about the secret meeting of Augusto Caraceni with the Duke of Windsor. He made a smoking for him. (A scandal back in those days!)
Maestro Caraceni is also revealing what distinguishes their garments from those of other makers. According to one of their customers it's the very soft and light weight interior (armatura)!
He also states that the fantasy and with it the variations of colours in the past has been replaced by choosing dark grey and blue to become "invisible". ;)

"Nur der ist Meister seiner Kunst, der immer sucht, das Gute zu verbessern und niemals glaubt, das Beste schon zu haben."
"Only he is a master of his art who always seeks to improve the good and never believes to have the best already"

http://www.dressedwell.net/ It's snarky, but fun.


#42 Schneidergott

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Posted 30 May 2010 - 05:19 PM

I had another look at the opened lapel and I think it doesn't need that much roll. Actually, a strong roll would not work with their transformable DB.
I guess the Duke's DB coats had the traditional make of lapel, that's why they look odd when he uses a different button (and only one, too)! Why is is admired for such a weird habit is beyond me.

That blue "Agnell" DB in the pic I posted is definitely a Sciamat, it's the denim coat they showed on their blog. Another example of how certain tailoring firms use names of sartorial celebrities. :Liar:

I had another look at the video and have to correct my formerly posted (lousy) translation:

The speciality of a Caraceni coat is the possibility to fold it like a handkerchief/ pocket square due to it's soft construction.

Edited by Schneidergott, 30 May 2010 - 06:37 PM.

"Nur der ist Meister seiner Kunst, der immer sucht, das Gute zu verbessern und niemals glaubt, das Beste schon zu haben."
"Only he is a master of his art who always seeks to improve the good and never believes to have the best already"

http://www.dressedwell.net/ It's snarky, but fun.


#43 carpu65

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Posted 31 May 2010 - 03:33 AM

I had another look at the opened lapel and I think it doesn't need that much roll. Actually, a strong roll would not work with their transformable DB.


Which is the secret of the tranformable lapels? :sorcerer:
This is a good technique question. :thumbsup:

Edited by carpu65, 31 May 2010 - 03:35 AM.


#44 Schneidergott

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Posted 31 May 2010 - 04:58 AM

Usually tailors put in a stay tape to keep the bridle short. By that the coat will exactly roll to the point where the tape ends.
If I interpreted what I saw in the video correctly, Caraceni does not have a stay tape all the way down (plus they use a strip of lining selvedge to keep it very flat). In most cases the lapel is pressed to end where the buttoning point is. Perhaps not in the case of Caraceni DBs.

"Nur der ist Meister seiner Kunst, der immer sucht, das Gute zu verbessern und niemals glaubt, das Beste schon zu haben."
"Only he is a master of his art who always seeks to improve the good and never believes to have the best already"

http://www.dressedwell.net/ It's snarky, but fun.


#45 Muscle Car TC

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Posted 13 June 2010 - 10:48 PM

Here, A Caraceni in Rome may have used just such a machine on both their chest canvas and lapels:

Posted Image

They charge about three thousands Euros or more for this bespoke work. So if you can keep your prices from a small "cottage boutique" workshop down so that your prices are a quarter of this or less you can make a living making for travellers to your shores. Tailors in Hong Kong and these days places like Thailand are well known amongst tourists from Europe, US, Japan etc as destinations to have a suit or dress made for a reasonable price. You will have to advertise where tourists go, if you are in a tourist area (I notice that you are in Trinidad!).

The advantage of this small workshop approach is that there is no pressure to manage a large number of employees, and it costs much less to set up. You only need a couple of good quality workers in your shop. For some work you can even allow employees to work from home. In Italy many women make buttonholes from home working as finishers. However, in many cases workers will sew a coat, skirt etc in their own home. Rather than relying on an investment in business infrastructure you rely on your knowledge and artisinal skill in cutting, sewing and fitting. It is a lower risk approach.


I think that the A. Caraceni Milano (the A. in A. Caraceni stands for Augusto, FWIW) jacket (from 1998) in that picture is a fake. Or, in 1998, A. Caraceni offered hand padded canvassing for the chest pieces, collars and lapels as an option-1.5 times extra cost (with machine padded canvassing or canvassing that is any combination of hand padded and machine padded for the chest pieces, collars and lapels being standard). Whatever the case might be, A. Cacaceni Milano (A. Caraceni is in Milan, NOT Rome, BTW) now exclusively hand pads the canvassing for the chest pieces, collars and lapels.

A. Caraceni Milano’s new website states (and heavily promote) that all of their bespoke clothing is completely hand made with no machines. Ferdinando Caraceni Milano’s new website also states (and heavily promote) that all of their bespoke clothing is completely hand made with no machines. Fortunately, these new websites can be properly translated from Italian to English (as well as from Italian to all languages other than English and Italian).

On Thursday, May 27th, 2010 at 1:29pm Eastern Daylight Time, Schneidergott posted a video from earlier this year with Mario Caraceni (son of Augusto Caraceni) super clearly showing canvassing that is 100% hand padded with absolutely NO machine padding what so ever. The video is in only in Italian for the time being, I am afraid. Schneidergott indicated that he has yet to be able to successfully do a proper translation from Italian to English (and from Italian to all languages other than English to Italian) with that video.

Here is the link to that video from earlier this year with Mario Caraceni of A. Caraceni:

http://www.maniwelt...otary/Nord.html

Enjoy, Sator :)

Edited by Muscle Car TC, 13 June 2010 - 11:06 PM.


#46 Muscle Car TC

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Posted 13 June 2010 - 11:00 PM

I at least found one video with Mario Caraceni (wearing one of his famous DB):

http://www.maniwealt...otary/Nord.html

Purtroppo in italiano solo!

Funny story about the secret meeting of Augusto Caraceni with the Duke of Windsor. He made a smoking for him. (A scandal back in those days!)
Maestro Caraceni is also revealing what distinguishes their garments from those of other makers. According to one of their customers it's the very soft and light weight interior (armatura)!
He also states that the fantasy and with it the variations of colours in the past has been replaced by choosing dark grey and blue to become "invisible". ;)


That video from earlier this year (with Mario Caraceni of A. Caraceni, son of Augusto Caraceni) super clearly shows canvassing that is 100% hand padded with absolutely NO machine padding. Please post that video when you succeed in doing a proper translation from Italian to all languages other than Italian (especially from Italian to English)? Thank you dearly and sincerely in advance! :)

#47 Schneidergott

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Posted 16 June 2010 - 02:09 AM

I'm afraid there are no hidden gems of knowledge in that video, if there are any I'm afraid my Italian is too poor to find them.
Perhaps Signor carpu65 could help us out?

I'm pretty sure that at Caraceni they talk to the customers about hand padded or machine padded lapels, since it would show during the fittings anyway.
The former owner of the Caraceni coat dissected by jefferyd is not a newbie to bespoke, so he would have easily spotted the fake/ cheat!





"Nur der ist Meister seiner Kunst, der immer sucht, das Gute zu verbessern und niemals glaubt, das Beste schon zu haben."
"Only he is a master of his art who always seeks to improve the good and never believes to have the best already"

http://www.dressedwell.net/ It's snarky, but fun.


#48 Muscle Car TC

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Posted 16 June 2010 - 03:00 AM

I'm afraid there are no hidden gems of knowledge in that video, if there are any I'm afraid my Italian is too poor to find them.
Perhaps Signor carpu65 could help us out?

I'm pretty sure that at Caraceni they talk to the customers about hand padded or machine padded lapels, since it would show during the fittings anyway. The former owner of the Caraceni coat dissected by jefferyd is not a newbie to bespoke, so he would have easily spotted the fake/ cheat!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kqLAg0O0TZw


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sxD61z8UmYM


That means that the three Caraceni operations (Augusto Caraceni Milano, Domenico Caraceni Roma and Ferdinando Caraceni Milano) definitely offer hand padded canvassing (and definitely talk to the customers about hand padded or machine padded canvassing) for the chest pieces, collars, lapels and waistbands (I accidentally left the waistbands out before, sorry about that) as an option (at one and a half times extra cost) with the machine padded canvassing for the chest pieces, collars, lapels and waistbands being standard. Like I said before, the first of those two videos super clearly shows hand padded (not machine padded) canvassing.

Or, the three Caraceni operations (again, Augusto Caraceni Milano, Domenico Caraceni Roma and Ferdinando Caraceni Milano) definitely offered hand padded canvassing (and definitely talked to the customers about hand padded or machine padded canvassing) for the chest pieces, collars, lapels and waistbands as an option (again, at one and a half times extra cost) with the machine padded canvassing for the chest pieces, collars, lapels and waistbands being standard back in the 1990s (including 1998, of course ;)).

Edited by Muscle Car TC, 16 June 2010 - 03:24 AM.

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#49 The_Sartorial_Journal

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Posted 16 September 2015 - 01:49 AM

Domenico Caraceni in Caraceni in the 30's (he's the one on the right):

domenicocaraceni.jpg

The team of Augusto Caraceni in front of the Milan Dome in 1946:

augustocaraceni.jpg

 

Hi there,

 

Which book are these from please? I'm trying to source images of the Caraceni family it for an article in a magazine?

 

Many thanks indeed for your help!



#50 Schneidergott

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Posted 16 September 2015 - 02:57 AM

 

 

Which book are these from please? I'm trying to source images of the Caraceni family it for an article in a magazine?

 

http://www.amazon.co...y/dp/B000AQSYRU


"Nur der ist Meister seiner Kunst, der immer sucht, das Gute zu verbessern und niemals glaubt, das Beste schon zu haben."
"Only he is a master of his art who always seeks to improve the good and never believes to have the best already"

http://www.dressedwell.net/ It's snarky, but fun.


#51 tombennett

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Posted 02 January 2016 - 09:05 PM

Hi, are the photos still available for this thread?






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