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2011, look modern and fashionable.


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#1 carpu65

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Posted 12 May 2011 - 01:08 AM

Talk about now, the year 2011,
not about past or strange suits of tomorrow.
Which is now the look modern and fashionable in bespoke?
Silhouette,models,proportions.

Clean cut or 30s reminiscent?
Three or two buttons,notched or peaks lapels?
Natural or square shoulders?
What about double breasted,which shape?
width of trousers,cuffs yes or not (or when)?
Braces,belts,or adjustable waistband?
These are actual italian trends for shapes and models
(from a fashion show of "Accademia dei Sartori"-"Tailors Accademy"):

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#2 Sator

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Posted 12 May 2011 - 01:43 AM

I would like a little touch of the '70s return in the form of a subtle bit of flare in the trousers - like on this example (from the 1950s):

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Or this example:

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Ever since the 80s shoulders have been rather same looking, and I would like to see a cleaner, crisper and higher shoulder with a bit more roping like those from Maurice Sedwell. However, the slightly effeminate narrowness of the chest-shoulder region common in the 1970s should be avoided, and it would be better that it rather be accompanied by a slightly fuller, more masculine structured chest with a good nipped waist.

I would also like to see extra panelling of the sort that you see from Davide Taub. This can be limited to just the back, but also curved front panels.

That said, I do also like the Man Men look with those shorter, fitted overcoats and narrow lapels:

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The lounge coat and trousers worn with this look should be cut along matching lines. The trousers need to be cut narrow and a little on the short side. I do think that some of the exaggeratedly narrow lapels on lounge jackets are not really flattering on some figures, but on the right person a cleanly fitted look with modestly narrow lapels is good. Likewise, there is a tendency to bizarrely exaggerate the shortness of the coat, and while the coat should be kept short, as with the slightly shorter trousers, not excessive. However, the armscye needs to be cut high and close to really complete this Bobby Kennedy type of look.

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I think the Neo Mod look will be with us for some time. The lines tend to be a bit severe and to add interest details like cuffed gauntlets sleeves would be nice to see more often.

#3 meiissi

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Posted 12 May 2011 - 02:38 AM

May I say that 2011 is in big sleeve-trouble??!??

#4 carpu65

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Posted 12 May 2011 - 05:25 AM

I would like a little touch of the '70s return in the form of a subtle bit of flare in the trousers - like on this example (from the 1950s):

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Or this example:

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Is a very sophisticated choise. If i understand well you inspire to a very brief,but interesting period (1968-1970 circa)
in which the 60s clean cut evolved,but before that the world become crazy with giant lapels and bell bottom trousers.
I think a silhouette like this:
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I think the Neo Mod look will be with us for some time.
The lines tend to be a bit severe and to add interest details like cuffed gauntlets sleeves would be nice to see more often.

I like much.

I like also lines like this: sharp and clean,but not skinny like some Boeting things


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#5 carpu65

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Posted 12 May 2011 - 09:50 AM

I think that This could be considered very modern and fashionable.
More,is interesting to cut for a tailor.

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#6 Sator

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Posted 12 May 2011 - 11:53 AM

I like also lines like this: sharp and clean,but not skinny like some Boateng things


I think part of the problem with Boateng RTW is that the cuts look like the sort of generic thing that a computer assisted design (CAD) program would spew out. This is what gives it its "sameness". Overall it lacks any real shape.

#7 carpu65

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Posted 12 May 2011 - 12:45 PM

But exist a "Boeteng" (real) bespoke?

#8 Sator

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Posted 12 May 2011 - 01:01 PM

This comes from the Boateng website:

By Appointment Only Bespoke Service

The Bespoke service is provided within the luxurious confines of Ozwald Boateng’s Bespoke Room in the Savile Row flagship store. The nature of the Bespoke service is not only based on the skills and physicality of creating an exclusive suit, but also the need to share and reflect the personality, lifestyle and aspirations of Ozwald Boateng.

A vibrant young team of highly skilled tailors bring to life the unique, one-off designs that Ozwald Boateng creates for his bespoke clients. Made by hand, the bespoke suits adhere to the age old disciplines and etiquettes of Savile Row tailoring, fused with the know–how and distinctive touch Ozwald Boateng applies to the finished product.

The Bespoke service experience starts with an appointment offered to discuss your requirements; whether the suit is for your wedding, special occasion or every day wear. Fabrics, style, linings and details will be discussed along with your needs, which are of the highest importance. We will take your measurements, and consult on further appointments where necessary.

Bespoke

Bespoke is the highest quality line on offer by Ozwald Boateng. Your suit will be cut from scratch, handmade and created by our team of highly skilled tailors. Your suit is made only for you, and will fit you to perfection.

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It would be interesting to see it. However, I can't say I find the lines of this sketch from the same page very attractive:

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The seam placement doesn't make any sense (typical "designer" doodle). It's just the lapels are too extreme, severe and shapeless to give it any grace.

#9 Sator

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Posted 12 May 2011 - 01:09 PM

The other interesting thing to note about this fashion illustration from the same Simpsons series from the 1970s is the Romanticism:

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Notice the full moon, and the castle in the background. You certain sees '70s films (?Visconti) with an atmosphere like that too.

Now watch this video of Edward Sexton where he talks about "romancing" the look with something more vivid at the neckline:



It's the same Romanticism that lead to the Byronic look with the frills on the shirt:

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#10 0815newbie

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Posted 12 May 2011 - 10:13 PM

I think that This could be considered very modern and fashionable.
More,is interesting to cut for a tailor.

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While viewing those pictures I suddenly thought the men on the pictures look pretty much like this funny little fellow:
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Sorry guys, if this will be the fashionable suit style in the year 2011 I am definatly going to skip it. It makes one look like a potato impaled on two thoothpicks......

#11 MANSIE WAUCH

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Posted 12 May 2011 - 11:38 PM

I enjoyed the Edward Sexton video, but I did not see anything different with that suit than anything from fifty years ago with the exeption of the trousers being far too clean. I would not like to bend down in a pair of trousers like that.

#12 carpu65

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Posted 12 May 2011 - 11:59 PM

But exist a 2011 silhouette?
30s,50s,60s,70s had a well definite shape for men apparel.
Tailors and ready to wear provided men with similar proportions in lapels,shoulders,widht of trousers,models...
Now seems to me that not exist a real fashion of the times.
We have all together skinny and drape suits, narrow and very large lapels,70s with 60s with 30s.
Is possible have a clear idea what is the mainstream style for men in Bespoke, MTM and RTW now in 2011?

#13 Sator

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Posted 13 May 2011 - 12:12 AM

I see this as a big problem. In the past, even the more conservatively dressed types showed some concession to fashion. Today the lounge suit is in general not as fashionable a garment for everyday wear, and it is being worn less and less in business and social situations where it was once very common. It is even considered an insult to call the wearer "a suit". The only attempts to escape from the negative associations of the lounge suit as a dull, conservative and boxy garment worn only by "squares in suits" and make to it fashionable again are too extreme and too bizarre to gain much acceptance in the real world. I think this has to change. It is not that hard to do if you take care with the fit and the styling issues.

That is to say there is a real fear of the lounge suit "going out of fashion" altogether. And this may be the real explanation for why the lounge coat suits being worn on the street have largely stopped showing any overall fashion trends. The theory that the lounge suit should be exempt from fashion by Eternal Style, and that you should just wear the lounge suit fashions of a hundred years ago, because you wouldn't notice the difference anyway, risks accelerating the pace at which it goes out of fashion to become period costume.

#14 Digby Snaffles

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Posted 13 May 2011 - 12:33 AM

It makes one look like a potato impaled on two thoothpicks


I personally disagree. Of course it depends on the cut but I don't think a wider cut trouser harmonises with a fitted jacket at all!

That is to say there is a real fear of the lounge suit "going out of fashion" altogether.


Perhaps but we have to remember that counter-culture works both ways. Just as the generation before eschewed the suit for "business casual" the next may embrace it. Personally I do detect a growing enthusiasm for tailoring amongst my own generation (I'm 24), though we may have to resign ourselves to the fact that suits will no longer be everyday wear. I have a few friends who have not only started thinking about their work wardrobe but about suits for social situations.

...lounge coat suits being worn on the street have largely stopped showing any overall fashion trends.


This is the issue I think. Inspired by recent television shows like 'Mad Men' or by the 'corporate yuppie culture' all we're in danger of seeing is mimicry as opposed to something new!

Edited by Digby Snaffles, 13 May 2011 - 12:34 AM.


#15 0815newbie

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Posted 13 May 2011 - 12:54 AM

I personally disagree. Of course it depends on the cut but I don't think a wider cut trouser harmonises with a fitted jacket at all!




It does work very well. Maybe this coat is not as fitted as the ones posted above but I like it this way. Well, this trousers might be a bit extreme in the other direction but I prefer a bit too wide to too narrow.

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However, I will never get the point of these discussions.

If you are talking about ready to wear garments everything is allright, but if you are talking about bespoke clothes I do not understand why I have to obey to stupid fahsion ideals. I want to have it my way because I have found my personal preferrence and so may have you. That is the real big deal about bespoke, I can have it my way.

Oh and do not try explaining that I copy this or that which has been there since decades. I have looked at very many styles and nearly everything has been there before. Personaly, Icannot see the problem about that fact. Well, I do wear jeans and stuff but I am not quiet as happy wearing them as I am when wearing my suits, coats etc.

I ask you who has the authority to judge me? We have troubles that are more severe that this in our society....

#16 carpu65

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Posted 13 May 2011 - 03:02 AM

I see this as a big problem. In the past, even the more conservatively dressed types showed some concession to fashion.


Indeed firms like Huntsman or Poole in 60s cut suits in the fashion silhouette of those days.
Believe or not this is Huntsman in 1961:

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Today the lounge suit is in general not as fashionable a garment for everyday wear.

That is to say there is a real fear of the lounge suit "going out of fashion" altogether. And this may be the real explanation for why the lounge coat suits being worn on the street have largely stopped showing any overall fashion trends.


Correct,i have fear that today the bespoke lounge suit is "mummified" in a never end 30slike silhouette.
Why?
Of course because bespoke cost are so high that the most of customers want a "timeless" suit ("i don't spend 5000£ for a thing that is out of fashion in two or three years,bespoke is a investment").
For the same reason young and innovative peoples stay away from bespoke.
In old days good tailors were a lot,and also prices of the best were affordables; So follow trend fashion (and i don't talk of the stupid catwalk costumes of today) was considered normal.

Edited by carpu65, 13 May 2011 - 03:14 AM.


#17 tailleuse

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Posted 13 May 2011 - 12:40 PM

It is even considered an insult to call the wearer "a suit".


Don't forget the mocking of someone for wearing a "monkey suit." "Suits" are boring, but powerful.



Dignity. Always, dignity. (Singin' in the Rain)


#18 Sator

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Posted 13 May 2011 - 01:20 PM

If you are talking about ready to wear garments everything is allright, but if you are talking about bespoke clothes I do not understand why I have to obey to stupid fahsion ideals. I want to have it my way because I have found my personal preferrence and so may have you. That is the real big deal about bespoke, I can have it my way.


Even those '30s fashion plates are just the fashion of the period. It is not Eternal Style but fashion pure and simple. When you read the texts that accompany these old fashion plates the commentators had no delusions about it being anything other than the fashion of the season. The plates may look glamorous but in reality many garments of this era were pretty ugly.

nearly everything has been there before.


Not true at all. Do you wear Hessian boots to work? Does your standard business attire consist of a navy blue dress coat with gilt buttons worn with skin tight pantaloons? Do you wear a starched cravat?

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At one point everything you take for granted was a fashion novelty.

The notion of Permanent/Eternal Style is the biggest lie ever, and a pretty lame excuse to thoughtlessly default to wearing 80-100 year old fashions under the delusion that your fashion sense will be valid for all Eternity. It is a form of laziness that is contributing to the lounge coat going rapidly out of fashion, like the frock coat early last century.

Remember that the moment lounge coats go out of fashion to the point that they stop featuring in fashion designer's collection, the "style" of the lounge coat will be about as permanent as that of the frock coat. Unfortunately, we are getting closer and closer to that point with every year that goes by. The complacency induced by this mummified and comatose notion of Permanent Style only brings the end closer.




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