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#37 tailleuse

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Posted 09 October 2011 - 11:15 AM

I should also add that it is very easy to empathise (if not sympathise) where Windsor was coming from. Take a look at this:

Posted Image

Tsar Nicholas II and George V look like identical twins. They are relatives after all. When the Bolsheviks took over, they murdered a large number of Windsor's relatives. The Duke of Edinburgh recently said of the Communists that "the bastards murdered half my family". Part of the support amongst the British upper classes for fascism came from a hatred for Communism, and a desire to avenge their murdered Romanov relatives. The Nazis were the most vitriolic anti-Bolshevik political force in the 1930s, and it is not surprising then that a large proportion of the British upper class supported them. This explains why, in the middle of WWII, Windsor wanted Churchill and Hitler to "kiss and make up": to join forces in a battle to exterminate Bolshevism, and avenge the murdered Romanovs.

From Windsor's point of view, he almost certainly also saw it as an opportunity for the Royal Family to regain real and meaningful political power, rather than remaining an impotent symbolic head of state. The fact that Windsor made blatant political statements, flagrantly in contradiction to the British government to a degree unthinkable from the Royal Family today, reveals a keen political mind - and not naive in the slightest degree. The only naive thing about Windsor was his belief that it was only a matter of time before Hitler deposed the British government, and that he would be redeemed from his shameful place as the Governor of the Bahamas to be reinstated as the Leader of Fascist Britain.


As I'm sure you know, Nicholas II begged his cousin, George V to allow his (Nicholas's) family to come to England to live when they were under threat. George refused, because his own political position was precarious. Of course he didn't know what would happen at Yekaterinburg.

Edited by tailleuse, 09 October 2011 - 11:27 AM.

Dignity. Always, dignity. (Singin' in the Rain)


#38 carpu65

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Posted 09 October 2011 - 12:25 PM

The Duke of Edinburgh recently said of the Communists that "the bastards murdered half my family".


Well,is a shared opinion.



Schicklgruber.


Oh,Right,Schicklgruber..
Talking about bastards...

#39 Schneidergott

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Posted 11 October 2011 - 05:35 AM

Back to iGents and such The following images come from the film "Funny face" ("Ein süßer Fratz" in German), starring Audrey Hephurn and prime A&S customer Fred Astaire.
(On a personal note: I threw up a bit in my mouth watching those kissing scenes with Astaire and Hephurn. No matter how famous they are, men in their late 50 or more shouldn't play the romantic hero. all those wrinkles are not sexy!)

First, Astaire walking, displaying one of the famous drape coats. And seeing his right side, a lot of drape it is:

Posted Image

Second, standing, same thing showing, plus one can imagine how much overcut the shoulders were, I'd say at least one inch.

Posted Image

And at last, a DB coat buttoned at the lower button:

Posted Image

Don't get me wrong, the combination of suit colour with shirt, tie and socks (which are pale blue, too) works, but the coat looks very 30's to me. Mind you, the film was made in 1956/7.

"Nur der ist Meister seiner Kunst, der immer sucht, das Gute zu verbessern und niemals glaubt, das Beste schon zu haben."
"Only he is a master of his art who always seeks to improve the good and never believes to have the best already"

http://www.dressedwell.net/ It's snarky, but fun.


#40 NJS

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Posted 11 October 2011 - 05:53 AM

As I'm sure you know, Nicholas II begged his cousin, George V to allow his (Nicholas's) family to come to England to live when they were under threat. George refused, because his own political position was precarious. Of course he didn't know what would happen at Yekaterinburg.


In fact, the British government was prepared to send the Royal Navy to fetch them but Geo V vetoed it. If he had no exact premonition of their eventual murder, it would have taken very little imagination to have realized that he was leaving them in the hands of unsympathetic captors.

Anyway is there such a thing as an i-Punk?
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#41 tailleuse

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Posted 11 October 2011 - 08:36 AM

In fact, the British government was prepared to send the Royal Navy to fetch them but Geo V vetoed it. If he had no exact premonition of their eventual murder, it would have taken very little imagination to have realized that he was leaving them in the hands of unsympathetic captors.

Anyway is there such a thing as an i-Punk?
NJS


I didn't know that the British government had a rescue plan in place. George V must have been terrified of his standing.

I still don't understand what an i-Gent is but am beginning to think that my life won't exactly be impoverished if I continue on in ignorance. My own particular bugaboo, although benign by comparison with the i-Gentry, is with women home sewers who worship the '50s. It was one of the most repressive periods in American history and was not a good time for women (not to mention other marginalized groups)! The clothes were often ugly and always uncomfortable.

I just don't get it.



Dignity. Always, dignity. (Singin' in the Rain)


#42 Digby Snaffles

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Posted 11 October 2011 - 08:38 AM

Given we're all such ardent fans of 'is Royal Foppishness the Duke of Windsor The Daily Wail seemed the most prudent choice of newspaper.

The 'Downton Effect (or is that Affect?)'

I've noticed this 50s chic trend. It ties in with 'Rockabilly' fashion. Tattooed girls who dress as twee housewives and aspire to be burlesque dancers. There seems to be a load of them down in Brighton.

Edited by Digby Snaffles, 11 October 2011 - 08:53 AM.


#43 tailleuse

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Posted 11 October 2011 - 08:57 AM

...
(On a personal note: I threw up a bit in my mouth watching those kissing scenes with Astaire and Hephurn. No matter how famous they are, men in their late 50 or more shouldn't play the romantic hero. all those wrinkles are not sexy!) ...



It's heartening to read that a man sees that. I lost all respect for a famous American film critic -- not that I had started with that much, as the guy is a pompous jerk -- when he seriously suggested that women found Fred Astaire sexier than Gene Kelly. GENE KELLY! Astaire was a gentleman and graceful, but this guy clearly knows zip about women.

[quPosted Image


<i>Dignity. Always, dignity.</i>

Edited by tailleuse, 11 October 2011 - 08:59 AM.

Dignity. Always, dignity. (Singin' in the Rain)


#44 tailleuse

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Posted 11 October 2011 - 09:09 AM

. Tattooed girls who dress as twee housewives and aspire to be burlesque dancers. There seems to be a load of them down in Brighton.


That describes to a T some women I see, except they're in Brooklyn, not Brighton.

Actually, I very much like the costumes in Downton Abbey, although the three dresses featured are not my favorites.



Dignity. Always, dignity. (Singin' in the Rain)


#45 Schneidergott

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Posted 11 October 2011 - 02:42 PM

I lost all respect for a famous American film critic -- not that I had started with that much, as the guy is a pompous jerk -- when he seriously suggested that women found Fred Astaire sexier than Gene Kelly. GENE KELLY! Astaire was a gentleman and graceful, but this guy clearly knows zip about women.


Lets not forget about this man (I hear women get crazy over him. Must be his Scottish accent, I guess):

Posted Image

As for Freddie's look/ style: It's totally 30's (it even has the same ripples and drags):

Posted Image

The wide trousers:

Posted Image

For comparison a fashion drawing from the 20's (which seems to be much closer to "eternal" style):

Posted Image

"Nur der ist Meister seiner Kunst, der immer sucht, das Gute zu verbessern und niemals glaubt, das Beste schon zu haben."
"Only he is a master of his art who always seeks to improve the good and never believes to have the best already"

http://www.dressedwell.net/ It's snarky, but fun.


#46 NJS

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Posted 11 October 2011 - 11:56 PM

The Geo V and Czar thing: yes the RN was all ready, with Geo V's agreement, to go and blast some bits off a few Bolshies but, because of the instability caused by the War; the rise of the union movements and the Easter Rising of 1916 in Ireland, Georgie got cold feet and left the Romanovs to their fate. Some speculate that his then late elder brother, the Duke of Clarence, would have saved the Romanovs. I think that Georgie was a bit of a squirt for leaving them and that they could have been quite easily and quietly assimilated as quasi-landed gentry in the shires - as others have been: Louis Napoleon and Prince Tulah of Thailand - remember too that even Napoleon, as he awaited his fate in Plymouth Sound, pacing up and down on decks of HMS Bellerophon, wanted exiled in the Green and Pleasant Land, before he was bundled off to send his snuff orders to Fribourg & Treyer, at Ye Sign of the Rasp and Crown, from St Helena.

However, not all the Romanovs were wiped out because, in April 1919, HMS Marlborough did evacuate the Dowager Empress and various members (including other senior members) of the family and Court and some of them did settle down in rural obscurity in various countries in exile, and their descendants live on.
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#47 Sator

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Posted 12 October 2011 - 01:08 AM

Also following up on the nasty oppressive regimes theme, it's funny how people regard Nazism as being the most evil regime in all of history. So much so that even being tainted with being a sympathiser means that your reputation is mud. Rightfully so too.

However, isn't it even funnier that in actual fact, the Nazis aren't the worst genocidal murderers in history at all - not by a long shot. The Chinese Communist Party is. Nobody even remotely objects to the fact that every time you buy something that is "made in China" a little of your money goes into the coffers of the very Party that is the worst genocidal organisation in all of history:

Mao Ze-Dong (China): 49-78,000,000

Adolf Hitler (Germany, 1939-1945): 12,000,000

Mao, the Father of the Chinese Communist Party, was far worse than Hitler. Unlike the Soviets, they have never gone through a Khrushchev type of "thaw" where they admitted the mistakes made in the past under Stalin. No recognition has been given to the murdered millions, let alone any expression of even the slightest remorse.

So every time someone buys a Chinese made garment they pay a little into the coffers of a Party worse than the National Socialist (Nazi) Party while putting someone in the first world out of a job, because unlike in the West, independent trade unions are banned and workers are forced to work under slave labour conditions:

http://factsanddetai...d=9&subcatid=60

You never even hear the term "genocide" being raised as an issue, let alone whether it is ethical to even give a cent of your money to a murderer turned successful businessman.

That $200 dollar Chinese-made suit might seem "cheap" but someone, perhaps a child forced to work 100 weeks in a factory, has to pay the real human price - in blood, swear and tears. Then there is the blood of the forgotten murdered millions, whom the media dare not mention in case their wealthy Chinese share holders are offended. This is why I say that paying several thousand dollars to your local bespoke tailor is nothing in "real" terms.

#48 NJS

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Posted 12 October 2011 - 01:22 AM

It's heartening to read that a man sees that. I lost all respect for a famous American film critic -- not that I had started with that much, as the guy is a pompous jerk -- when he seriously suggested that women found Fred Astaire sexier than Gene Kelly. GENE KELLY! Astaire was a gentleman and graceful, but this guy clearly knows zip about women.

[quPosted Image


<i>Dignity. Always, dignity.</i>


Are you sure about this? I mean it's not just about appearances is it? Some incredibly ugly toads have got women that were fit for Princes - Mickey Rooney, Picaso and Onasis, for example - and money alone cannot make up the difference, can it?
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#49 carpu65

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Posted 12 October 2011 - 02:54 AM

For comparison a fashion drawing from the 20's (which seems to be much closer to "eternal" style):

Posted Image


20s style was much more equilibrate and balanced that 30s.
During 20s you can found 60s style clean suit and classic proportion double breasted suits,slim trousers and oxford bags,froack coats and double breasted dinner jackets.
Is more various and interesting that 30s.
Unfortunately 20s have a problem:
30s is ever close to us,for the movies,but 20s have mute movies that for the most are lost on in archives..so the decade is less visible.

Edited by carpu65, 12 October 2011 - 02:58 AM.


#50 Schneidergott

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Posted 13 October 2011 - 01:27 AM

You never even hear the term "genocide" being raised as an issue, let alone whether it is ethical to even give a cent of your money to a murderer turned successful businessman.

That $200 dollar Chinese-made suit might seem "cheap" but someone, perhaps a child forced to work 100 hours in a factory, has to pay the real human price - in blood, sweat and tears. Then there is the blood of the forgotten murdered millions, whom the media dare not mention in case their wealthy Chinese share holders are offended. This is why I say that paying several thousand dollars to your local bespoke tailor is nothing in "real" terms.


If someone wanted to avoid dealing with countries/ businessmen/ companies which had been involved in genocide, illegal and/or unjustified war, massive child or slave labour there would hardly be any left.

Great Britain: Conquering half the world without any legitimization, also playing a big role in slavery (just like some Arab empires of those days).
Germany: Mostly during the Nazi regime, starting another war, killing people in gas chambers because of some inhuman and utterly wrong and stupid ideology. Some of the companies still existing profited directly from people working in concentration camps.
USA: Several wars against native people in the colonies and the later states, a couple of wars, also supporting South American and African dictators.
Soviet Union and Russia: More or less fighting against their own population from 1917 to late 50's, not to forget Afghanistan and Chechnya (which is still in progress).
Italy and Spain: Fascist dictators, civil wars.
France: Colonies in Africa, South America and South-East Asia. And just recently: For not supporting the war against the late Saddam Hussein.
Several South American countries because of ultra right wing dictators suppressing/ killing their own people. Would mostly effect the sales of fruits, alcohol, tobacco products and beef.
Countries which have oil or eliminate the rain forest.
Japan, for what they did in South East Asia.
South Africa, along with a few other countries on that continent.
Several other countries with colonies, civil wars or involved in slavery or human trafficking (which is any country with a major soccer, football, basketball, rugby and cricket league!:spiteful:)

And of course, China.

The really funny fact about all of this is that the West gave away it's know-how more or less for free, just to get access to cheap work force. Because that is all China had to offer back then.
Now they make money with our know-how and buy up Western companies.
Plus you almost cannot avoid buying something made in China. It's not just the clothes, it's electronics (even in cars), tools, toys, household appliances and so on.

The only save way to avoid supporting Chinese companies and government would probably be to see your local tailor to have a bespoke garment made (unless he/ she is in China).
The fact that the fabrics are most likely from the UK or Italy is acceptable.;)

"Nur der ist Meister seiner Kunst, der immer sucht, das Gute zu verbessern und niemals glaubt, das Beste schon zu haben."
"Only he is a master of his art who always seeks to improve the good and never believes to have the best already"

http://www.dressedwell.net/ It's snarky, but fun.


#51 NJS

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Posted 13 October 2011 - 03:00 AM

^
Mmn - Britain's Empire did grow, in part, out of military conquest but also out of trading links and, for all that is said against it these days, it did involve a good deal of mutuality of benefit; some of which, in terms of infra-structure, are still there. On slavery: Britons certainly were involved in the slave trade but it should also be remembered that, as long ago as 1772, Lord Mansfield declared that slavery was unsupported by English law although it was some time before slavery was abolished in the colonies. Moreover, the British played an important part in stamping out slavery in such places as Brazil, by blockading the ports to which they were being brought. None of these issues, or the others that you mention, are quite straightforward.

Let's not also forget Joe Stalin.

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#52 Schneidergott

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Posted 13 October 2011 - 04:10 AM

Let's not also forget Joe Stalin.



That man of steel probably blamed a whole lot of his victims on the Germans.

I should also add the conquistadores, who slaughtered a fair amount of natives in South America.

Isn't it weird that history hardly remembers the nice guys?

I actually wonder how much iGents have actually done to increase demand for full bespoke (or dressing better in general). I recall J.H. saying in a video that A&S had a 30% increase in orders, does anyone know if similar figures can be reported from other tailoring firms (especially those who do not offer the soft drape style by default)?

I also read somewhere that, weird enough, recession is causing an increase of interest, too. People tend to look for some serious, though more expensive, longer lasting clothing instead of throw away, fast fashion.
The main challenge will be to keep that interest at a high level so that tailoring firms will invest in the education of young tailors and dressmakers in Western countries.

Based on the experiences I made in the last weeks regarding the skills of modern day RTW pattern makers and clothing engineers I wouldn't want to rely on them in the future.

Standard size 48 (more or less, chest 96 cm) and no, there was no way to have this lie calm and flat on the table:

Posted Image

Trust me, I have tried:

Posted Image

"Nur der ist Meister seiner Kunst, der immer sucht, das Gute zu verbessern und niemals glaubt, das Beste schon zu haben."
"Only he is a master of his art who always seeks to improve the good and never believes to have the best already"

http://www.dressedwell.net/ It's snarky, but fun.


#53 tailleuse

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Posted 13 October 2011 - 07:39 AM

20s style was much more equilibrate and balanced that 30s.
During 20s you can found 60s style clean suit and classic proportion double breasted suits,slim trousers and oxford bags,froack coats and double breasted dinner jackets.
Is more various and interesting that 30s.
Unfortunately 20s have a problem:
30s is ever close to us,for the movies,but 20s have mute movies that for the most are lost on in archives..so the decade is less visible.


He looks a bit too much like Mack the Knife in the G.W. Pabst movie of The Threepenny Opera (1931). I wish I could find a still of the scene when Lotte Lenya sings Seeräuber Jenny. Mackie Messer appears around at 1:03.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ec0clERjQ5A&list=PL52AFEDFDA5D6A3FB&index=10

Edited by tailleuse, 13 October 2011 - 07:41 AM.

Dignity. Always, dignity. (Singin' in the Rain)


#54 Schneidergott

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Posted 16 October 2011 - 04:18 AM

He looks a bit too much like Mack the Knife in the G.W. Pabst movie of The Threepenny Opera (1931). I wish I could find a still of the scene when Lotte Lenya sings Seeräuber Jenny. Mackie Messer appears around at 1:03.


Actually, his suit is much closer to what you see on the catwalks: Relatively short coat, close fitting, trousers close fitting with no pleats. The actor has the typical figure of many men of that era: The hips are equal to or wider than the chest.

Posted Image

Posted Image

"Nur der ist Meister seiner Kunst, der immer sucht, das Gute zu verbessern und niemals glaubt, das Beste schon zu haben."
"Only he is a master of his art who always seeks to improve the good and never believes to have the best already"

http://www.dressedwell.net/ It's snarky, but fun.





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